Me and my buddy Osama

*sigh*

Published on September 7, 2004 By Muggaz In Blogging

I can tell you one thing my friends, Me and Osama have the same kind of relationship as I do with George W. Bush, I like neither of them, and If I were their biggest fans, I would be whispering similar sweet nothings into both their ears in regards to how I am in total disagreement with their methods.

The reason for this blog was a comment made on the Muggaz appreciation thread – I was referred to as Osama’s biggest fan, and a coward among other things. Unfortunately, I don’t have the power of seeing how people perceive me, nor do I know why they would perceive me as such. I hope I would have done enough to prove that I am a genuine, peace loving young man, rather than a vitriolic hate filled person that the jaded among us would have others believe.

My greatest fear in this world is not the world I live in, but the world my children will live in. If caring about that makes me evil, call me Satan, because I am as evil as pie. When I see article’s professing hatred of Islam, my concern is not for the wellbeing of the terrorists, it is for the wellbeing of the general populace of the nations terrorists inhabit, and as a further extension, the general populace of the world. It has come to my attention that in my concern for many people, I have offended but a few with my remarks.

If what I say can only incite disdain within individuals of this community, I am genuinely apologetic – I cannot apologise enough to a certain individual who sincerely believes I would have him dead – I cannot re-iterate enough times how that is not the case at all, and Greywar – if you knew me at all, you would believe me and my sincerity. I cannot redeem what I have said, but by the same token I do not take those remarks back. The article in question is reason enough for Islam to hate western society. My ideals involve Islam understanding the west, and the west to understand Islam – I may be glorifying the readership, but articles like that are genuine steps backwards – you are a member of the armed forces, it is those in the armed forces who should desire peace the most. Islam by its current interpretations is backwards, but flaming Islam itself rather than the thugocracies who hide behind it will not get us anywhere.

If I were Osama’s biggest fan, maybe he would listen to me, when I tell him that America and her allies is not the enemy, do you think he would listen if I showed him the hate filled articles that come from this site alone? If I were George’s biggest fan, I would tell him to stop doing business with the thugocracies of the Middle East – get out of Saudi Arabia whilst their establishments encourage Anti-Infidel sentiments… I am neither biggest fan, and neither would listen to me.

Whilst I cannot influence their actions, I can control my own – and if this involves me being hated by those who see nothing but evil in Islam, and hated by those who blindly follow George W. Bush, I can’t do anything to change that, those that would make enemies out of me will always believe I am attacking them and their ideals, and those that would have me as a friend know exactly what I am about as a person.

I hate having to justify my actions and comments like this, I have always been taught to see the best in people, and that is what I try and do, If people choose to see the worst in me, it is their prerogative, I can assure you though – I am no fan of Osama bin Laden, I am certainly no coward, and when certain individual’s have to draw the line some place and write entire blogs flaming me, drawing the line is what I am doing when I see hate filled articles that only encourage regression and contempt for other people just because of their religion.

I have no authority within this community, I have integrity though – and I will never let anyone try to intimidate that out of me.

BAM!!!

Comments (Page 1)

trina_p

on Sep 07, 2004

Good Article Muggaz - Honest and Concise

While I doubt that it will have much of an effect on the people who have already made up their minds about you it will hopefully do some good to calm some of the waters.

Although the title of this article could have some negative effects - especially if someone didn't bother to actually read it but formed an opinion by the title and the author.

Overall good job!

Furry Canary

on Sep 07, 2004

Trina_p, I quite agree - although for people to take exception to the title of the article without reading it would tell all anybody needed to know about them.

There is a HUGE difference between being Osama Bin Laden's 'greatest fan' on the one hand, and holding Islam solely responsible for all America's woes on the other. Neither strikes me as the slightest bit constructive. What 'answers' may exist lie - surely - somewhere between these extremes. The Western world in general, and the USA in particular, often paint themselves as the moral / political (and economic) custodians of the planet in general. Others, almost by definition, do not necessarily see things from the same perspective, and often for very compelling reasons. Muggaz merely suggests that we should examine some of these reasons and attempt to see the other perspectives before arguing for the blanket condemnation of Islam. Does that make him Osama Bin Laden's greatest fan? Of course not.

Sadly, post 11 September 2001, the already often overbearing demand upon Americans to salute the flag unquestioningly has become even more prevalent. Just look at Bush and Kerry, and their increasingly hysterical attempts to 'out- patriotise' each other all the way to the election. I hasten to add that I am not attacking Americans here - indeed, I suspect this climate must be very difficult to negotiate, and I do not envy you this task. All I am saying is that currently the American culture often appears to demand a knee-jerk reaction of blind patriotism - that 'my country, right or wrong' attitude - and failure to comply can lead to accusations of one being 'unpatriotic', 'un-American' (a term which may ring alarm bells with those who are familiar with J. Edgar Hoover's crusade against Communism in the 1950s), 'pro-Osama' etc.

Muggaz, I think you're spot on here. You and I have had our differences in the past, and - who knows? - we will probably have more in the future. The point is that this is a good thing - democracy without robust debate becomes just a meaningless verbal reflex. If those who disagree with you respond only by name-calling in this way, to my mind they have lost the argument already.

Muggaz

on Sep 07, 2004

Thanks for your well thought out and encouraging response FC - it's good to know that some people can read between the lines, and concentrate on the greater purpose.

Trina - your comments and support are always welcomed.... thanks guys.

BAM!!!

The Crusaders

on Sep 07, 2004

Muggaz,

I think , from what I have noticed, that sometimes it's hard to know exactly where someone is coming from through the medium that is JU....with the inability to see anothers body language ...read their emotions vividly in their eyes....hear the subtle change of tone in their voice ..all of which helps us to grasp anothers wave length ...
So, don't let it bother you too much .....you know what you mean and sometimes people wont fully understand straight away as they are looking through their eyes and may simply focus on one singular point...but hopefully they give you the chance to re explain further if need be.
I have been reminded by being here not to jump to hasty conclusions and to give people a chance to listen and speak further to clarify mistaken disagreements.
What is also important is not to use pride as a stubborn way to dislike someone purely because they said something you did not like at some stage....We change everyday and life is too precious to not forgive and forget and move on.

Angloesque

on Sep 07, 2004

Muggaz, you know I don't take sides (most of the time) and I enjoy reading both you and Greywar. I am at a loss for words.

Really. I've typed in about eight paragraphs now and deleted them.

I guess the bottom line is that I commend your thoughtfulness and attempts to find the root of the problem--it's more effective than complaining about the effects. I fancy that I'm like that as well, though maybe not so publicly.

-A.

citahellion

on Sep 07, 2004

The article in question is reason enough for Islam to hate western society.

For someone who sees such great power in words, you don't seem to be particularly careful in tossing them around yourself. You could probably save yourself a whole lot of trouble, disagreements, flames, et cetera if you put some more effort into expressing yourself clearly and unambiguously.

So, don't let it bother you too much .....you know what you mean and sometimes people wont fully understand straight away

On the other hand, if you've developed a clear pattern of having your words consistently taken in ways you never intended, ways that repeatedly cause hostile reactions, I think it should bother you some. You need to stop and think for a while before you hit the old "submit" button.

Seriously, I think you should go and look at the quotes of yours that little whip posted in her flame. Evaluate them as if you hadn't written them yourself, as if you'd never seen them before.
I think that if you look at them honestly with fresh eyes, you'll see that the words you wrote are clearly inflammatory. "If I were Muslim, I'd put an edict on Greywar's head right now."
Yes, I know you've tried to explain it away, but seeing that, how could anyone interpret it in a positive, "Muggaz-lovin" light?

Muggaz

on Sep 07, 2004

Seriously, I think you should go and look at the quotes of yours that little whip posted in her flame. Evaluate them as if you hadn't written them yourself, as if you'd never seen them before.
I think that if you look at them honestly with fresh eyes, you'll see that the words you wrote are clearly inflammatory. "If I were Muslim, I'd put an edict on Greywar's head right now."

I understand what you are asking me to do, and I would be happy to oblidge - Ask Greywar and Little Whip to do the same from the eyes of a Muslim though, and tell me the very words they wrote are not inflamatory.

I have never said my remarks weren't inflamatory, they certainly were, because I was genuinely incensed. When I read Greywars article, I had to go outside and have a cigarette, and contemplate why Muslims hate the west so much... I can tell you right now, I would be cleaning up after myself a lot more than I am now If i had replied straight away.

Truth be told Cithellion - MOST people I deal with do take me the way I am supposed to be taken, forgive me for being human - I dont come to blog to perfect my grammar, writing or articulation skills - I come here to share my honest opinions - the former three are bi-products of why I come here.... Maybe you should re-read my counter article to Greywars - quite a few people commended me for my stance, and I only needed to justify myself to a few people who choose to read into the absolute worst possible context.

Perceive me how you will - maybe others will save themselve a whole lot of trouble by not assuming the worst when it comes to me - it works both ways.

BAM!!!

Gideon MacLeish

on Sep 07, 2004

muggaz,

The fact that greywar's article is perceived as "a reason to hate" in itself serves as an indicator of the flawed foundation upon which SOME Muslim clerics build their theology.

Some see it as a reason to hate, others as a reason to educate. And hope lies in the latter, not the former.

Muggaz

on Sep 07, 2004

The fact that greywar's article is perceived as "a reason to hate" in itself serves as an indicator of the flawed foundation upon which SOME Muslim clerics build their theology.

Some see it as a reason to hate, others as a reason to educate. And hope lies in the latter, not the former.

Gid,

You know I place as much hope in the former as you do. I know there are methods to the madness, I just dont particularly think that the methods used by Greywar - insulting Islam with the most vile insults imaginable, are the correct ones... you are as bad as the Muslim clerics if you do that...

BAM!!!

Sally jacobs

on Sep 08, 2004

Mugz I think you are wicked, I think you're open and honest, and you wear your heart on your sleeve. That sometimes leaves you open to critics and people taking you the wrong way, but I wouldn't have you any other way. It's what makes you so brilliant, that you are always so honest and opinionated. People won't always agree with you, I haven't on occassion, but where would the fun be if we did all the time?

The people that this article is aimed at won't change their opinion, and I wouldn't expect them too. They have made their mind up about you, and so be it. I can see how some things you have said could be percieved as wrong, but attacking people, and not being willing to listeni isn't the answer to any of this. You're strong, and you will carry on doing what you believe in. Be true to yourself Mugz, and nothing else matters.

kingbee

on Sep 08, 2004

if you really were his buddy, youd spell it usama not osama (i cant get ya off the hook for your close relationship with george bush tho...sorry)

kingbee

on Sep 08, 2004

ooops the bin laden curse strikes again. please delete one of those?

citahellion

on Sep 08, 2004

insulting Islam with the most vile insults imaginable, are the correct ones... you are as bad as the Muslim clerics if you do that...

Do you mean as bad as the radical Muslim clerics who get people to stone suspected adulteresses, who advocate the destruction of non-muslims, who celebrate the death of innocents? Because if you do, I'd have to say you have a very bad case of moral relativism.

Please describe what you think an average muslim is like. Because from what you've posted so far (in a variety of posts and threads), the impression I have gotten is this:
your average muslim is a depressed, self-hating, world-hating, hyper-sensitive, suicidal moron.

KarmaGirl

on Sep 08, 2004

You know I place as much hope in the former as you do. I know there are methods to the madness, I just dont particularly think that the methods used by Greywar - insulting Islam with the most vile insults imaginable, are the correct ones... you are as bad as the Muslim clerics if you do that...

Uh, What?!?! How can you say that *saying* something is as bad as *doing* something? One is an opinion, the other is killing people. How can you justify that?

For the record, it's statements like those that get you in hot water. First you are acting like you are apologizing to Greywar, now you are saying he is as bad as a cleric.

Manopeace

on Sep 08, 2004

Please describe what you think an average muslim is like. Because from what you've posted so far (in a variety of posts and threads), the impression I have gotten is this:your average muslim is a depressed, self-hating, world-hating, hyper-sensitive, suicidal moron.

Whoever believes the above is as ignorant as one can get! Your average Muslim is no different than your average Christian, Jew , Buddhist or anything else.

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